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| Difference between recession and depression | Views: 817 |
| Jan 27, 2009 4:07 am | | Difference between recession and depression | # |
Scott Wolpow | | A recession is when the middle class has no money. A depression is when the rich have no money. -Scott Wolpow Private Reply to Scott Wolpow |
| Jan 27, 2009 2:05 pm | | re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
Kurt Schweitzer | | Ah, but would it still be a depression if the middle class HAD money, but the rich did not?
(For some reason I'm getting flashes of Sesame Street's "Love of Chair" skits. "The boy is sitting on the chair. Will the boy get up? Will the chair fall over? And what about Naiomi?")
And what about the poor?
Kurt Schweitzer
Urban Village ScootersPrivate Reply to Kurt Schweitzer |
| Jan 27, 2009 6:53 pm | | re: re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
John Stephen Veitch | | In a depression prices cannot be sustained by the market. So there is a tendency for prices to fall rather than rise.
Because incomes are insecure people restrain their buying.
Because sales are difficult firms restrain employment.
Because the outlook is uncertain investment is restrained.
This is a circle of events that feeds on itself. It will only reverse when people have confidence in the future.
That's where good political leadership and strong business leadership becomes essential.
Throwing any amount of money at the problem CANNOT fix it. It's not about the money. At heart, the problem we have is a moral one. How should humans live on a finite planet.
We thought we had a wonderful idea about that. We should invest in industry and improve production and when we were very productive we would ALL be RICH.
We now know that long before we all get RICH, we destroy the environment, we become engaged in resource wars and we destroy the social conditions that make a good life possible. We also know that in a global economy, we can't solve this problem at a national level.
Poverty for some and wealth for US, isn't a acceptable.
Continuation of environmental destruction isn't acceptable.
Endless war isn't acceptable.
Political repression might bring "stability" but it isn't acceptable.
The rule of law, International Law, has to be effective. We cannot allow rogue states to do what they please in the world. (Even if that rogue state is the USA, or Israel.)
We cannot rebuild a new world economy based on the old model. The result of that would be a short term victory and a long term disaster. Pouring too much money into the economy now can only buy that wrong solution.
We need wise heads. We need to understand that the secret of success is to get the core of what we are doing right.
John Stephen Veitch
Open Future Limited - http://www.openfuture.biz/
Innovation Network - http://veech-network.ryze.com/
Building an Open Future - http://openfuture-network.ryze.com/Private Reply to John Stephen Veitch |
| Jan 27, 2009 7:43 pm | | Re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
Teddy Towncrier | |
Depression is a condition that can often be cleared up with a pill or diet change.
Recession is an action often taken when a new strategy is needed.
Bestest.
Teddy Towncrier CPP Towncrier-Media.com Supercharging Your Visions.
 
Private Reply to Teddy Towncrier |
| Jan 28, 2009 3:15 am | | re: Re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
Scott Wolpow | | John,
It was meant to be humorious, with some truth. Private Reply to Scott Wolpow |
| Jan 28, 2009 4:59 am | | re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
Kent Allen | | funny...
I'd say that the difference in today's media driven world is purely a matter of when broadcast news chooses to call it a recession or a depression (regardless of economic definitions).
Of course I avoid broadcast (and cable) news almost completely.
Kent Allen
Three Stone Media, Inc: http://www.threestonemedia.com
Twitter: http://twitter.com/esoomllubPrivate Reply to Kent Allen |
| Jan 28, 2009 5:25 am | | re: re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
Ashish Belagali | | Depression is what happens to us because of Recession. :-)
But really, I am not clear on them. How are these two different from each other? What's the measure which tells whether we are in one against the other?
/Ashish
----
Web applications/ Software solution http://www.acism.comPrivate Reply to Ashish Belagali |
| Jan 28, 2009 1:56 pm | | re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
Patricia Allen | | Hi Scott,
I love this definition! Thanks for the giggle this morning!
Love and Light.
Pat
Creator of fine wood pens.
http://www.PatsPensAndTreasures.com
http://www.PatriciaAJAllen.com/myblogPrivate Reply to Patricia Allen |
| Feb 03, 2009 2:42 pm | | re: re: re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
abbeboulah | | "Poverty for some and wealth for US, isn't a acceptable.
Continuation of environmental destruction isn't acceptable.
Endless war isn't acceptable.
Political repression might bring "stability" but it isn't acceptable.
The rule of law, International Law, has to be effective. We cannot allow rogue states to do what they please in the world. (Even if that rogue state is the USA, or Israel.)"
Reminds me of a cartoon I saw in Punch magazine long time ago, showing an obviously seasick gentleman in the fancy saloon of a Channel Ferry, and the steward saying to him:
"You can't be sick in here, sir." (Tr: "Not acceptable.")
"I can't?" (Is.)Private Reply to abbeboulah |
| Feb 03, 2009 7:39 pm | | re: re: re: re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
Reg Charie | | What's the measure which tells whether we are in one against the other?
IMO, interest rates. They really go up in a recession.
Reg - NEW DEMO!! Turn photos into paintings http://FantasticMachines.com
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| Feb 06, 2009 11:34 pm | | re: re: re: re: re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
Eileen Brown | | Hey Folks.
Reg hit it right on the head. The inflatable money system
only makes the rich richer (the poor poorer) and puts
individuals and entire governments in hock up to their
eyeballs.
Take a few lessons from history on this one.
Eileen
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ABHP - JOIN this ACTIVE Ryze Network! - http://abhp-network.ryze.com/Private Reply to Eileen Brown |
| Feb 08, 2009 4:19 pm | | re: re: re: re: re: re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
abbeboulah | | Re: hitting it on the nail... the rising interest rates are only part of the story -- the recession part. And yes, the ones who charge the interest aren't really hurting, most likely even making more money. Depression comes when people can't pay those interest rates any more...
One could argue that a recession might even be necessary every once in a while to let the economy re-group and adjust to different circumstances. With the introduction of the automibile, the horse-and-carriage industries suffered a recession. When the damage from such adjustment gets so big that the entire economy can't recover from it, (e.g. when too many people were involved in the horse-and carriage industry lose their jobs, can't become automobile workers and can't buy cars because they have no income anymore, we have a depression: then the automobile industry etc. suffers as well.
Explained with a different simile: Recession is when the rich uy fires his gardener and makes him drop the rake on the lawn. Depression sets in when the rich guy can't see the rake because the grass grew too high, steps on it and gets hit in the face. Now both are hurting. Private Reply to abbeboulah |
| Feb 08, 2009 9:40 pm | | re: re: re: re: re: re: re: Difference between recession and depression | # |
John Stephen Veitch | | The difference between recession and depression is that a recession is short lived, and depression goes on, and on. and on, and sadly that's where we are at.
The real reasons go back to Bretton-Woods, but particularly the decision of the USA to move off the gold standard in 1971. That worked well for the USA. The US Dollar became the default reserve currency of the world. That led directly to the political view in the USA that "deficits don't matter". So successive governments, especially the Republicans have stoked the fire of inflation with deficit spending, that should have led to a decline in the value of US dollars, but because of the reserve currency status that didn't happen. Instead, wonder of wonders, people in foreign currencies ended up paying the USA a premium to use the US dollar in foreign exchange transactions. Effectively the USA let it's financial affairs get out of hand and the rest of the world paid the price. (From the USA's point of view, nice work if you can get it.)
But in economics, the real costs of what people choose to do eventually come home. You now definitely have a depression. So the question is how long will it last?
I refer you to my previous post in this thread. It will last until the structural problems that caused the depression are fixed. I think Iceland might be leading the world here. Iceland is a very small country, and people have been talking intensively among themselves on the Internet. They have decided apparently that ALL the political parties of Iceland have been irresponsible and NONE of their politicians are worthy. However, government must go on, so they've turned to the unlikely greens for leadership. Time will tell if that will work.
In the USA, the real problem is being avoided by both the Democrats and the Republicans. Business interests fund both parties, and they are entirely focused on how to "save" the business interests of the people who fund them. Sadly, the plight of "workers" isn't really a consideration and won't be until after the riots start. You can see today that Republicans are playing political games with the proposed recovery package. Burning cities will smarten them up a bit.
Ten years from now, I expect the depression will remain and that BOTH the Republicans and the Democrats will no longer exist as political forces. New political players that can prove they are relatively free of business interests, and who propose a whole new agenda for America will eventually take over.
The quickest way to get results is to change the way politicians are elected. Introduce proportional representation. Get some new innovative political ideas into the system. Give people votes that COUNT, and give them some real political choices. That's something that can be done, even in a depression.
John Stephen Veitch
Open Future Limited - http://www.openfuture.biz/
Innovation Network - http://veech-network.ryze.com/
Building an Open Future - http://openfuture-network.ryze.com/Private Reply to John Stephen Veitch |
| Feb 09, 2009 7:59 pm | | Difference between recession and depression: Refuse to Participate in either! | # |
Harley Steele | | A friend of mine Dr. Ivan Misner advises to establish a mindset to Refuse to Participate in the Recession. Easier said than done I know, but thinking positively does help. In fact, more millionaires have been created in recessions than any other time in history. So, why does most wealthy people stay wealthy even in hard times?
Things That Wealthy People Do
Wealthy people choose both. Poor people choose either/or.
Wealthy people learn and grow. Poor people think they know.
Wealthy people focus on their big picture or why's. Poor people focus on their little pictures or how's.
Wealthy people visualize what they desire. Poor people wonder how they will ever get what they desire.
Wealthy people go outside of their comfort zones. Poor people do all they can to protect their comfort zones.
Wealthy people send out abundance with thoughts, feelings, words and deeds. Poor people send out scarcity with thoughts, feelings, words and deeds.
Wealthy people leverage their time, talents and money with people. Poor people guard their time, talents and money with fear
Wealthy people know how to set their money blueprint. Poor people don't know they have a money blueprint.
My good friend tells a story about a family outing that emphasizes the point even further:
"We recently enjoyed a Lake Powell outing with friends and family. One of the popular things to do at Lake Powell is to jump off cliffs into the water. We stopped at a section of cliffs and several of us climbed up and jumped off cliffs anywhere from 20 feet up to 40 feet high.
My son is 13 years old. He stepped out to the edge of a 40 foot cliff and decided quickly that this was not for him. I told to walk down to the 20 foot cliff and try that one. He stepped out to the edge of the 20 foot cliff and still had his reservations. I went up and jumped off the cliff so he could see his old man do it. he thought about it for a while and finally decided he was going to do it. He simply stepped off the edge and dropped safely to the water below. He swam to the boat and climbed aboard. As he entered the boat he made a profound statement that we can all learn from. He said: "It's a lot easier when you don't think about it".
This is a big clue as to how to allow the things we want to flow into our lives. It's easier when we don't think about it. There comes a time when we simply do it. I guess we could add another statement to the list we mentioned above:
Wealthy people don't think about it, they do it. Poor people think about it and don't do it.
Harley Steele
http://www.sendthanksdaily.com
http://www.createloyalclients.com
http://www.gainreferralseasy.comPrivate Reply to Harley Steele |
| Feb 09, 2009 10:10 pm | | re: Difference between recession and depression: Refuse to Participate in either! | # |
Kurt Schweitzer | | While I agree with some parts of this, I don't agree with all of it.
Earlier this afternoon I heard a discussion on the radio about the "difficulties" for bank executives living on "only" $500,000 a year.
These are people whom the vast majority of the population regard as wealthy, while they themselves feel they are living on a shoestring. It's hard to stretch $500K when you have to pay $8K a month for rent, another $38K per child per year for schooling, $45K for a nanny, $50K for car and driver, and we haven't even considered food or clothing!
The point that was being made is that their lifestyle choices have them stuck in a situation where $500K is a hardship wage - it doesn't cover the bills.
Are these people truly wealthy?
"Wealthy people choose both. Poor people choose either/or."
Wealthy people choose to go after what's important to them, and don't let their resources get spent on "junk". They will buy high quality products and then hang on to them for as long as they still work. At the same time they don't hesitate to dispose of things that are no longer useful or important to them.
"Wealthy people visualize what they desire. Poor people wonder how they will ever get what they desire."
Poor people have dreams. Wealthy people have GOALS - dreams with plans for achieving them.
"Wealthy people go outside of their comfort zones. Poor people do all they can to protect their comfort zones."
This is one statement I completely agree with. You will never succeed unless you risk failure. If you're smart you'll EMBRACE FAILURE and learn from it, so you do better the next time!
"Wealthy people leverage their time, talents and money with people."
This is the one thing I have the hardest time doing. I am a loner by nature, but I'm smart enough to realize I can never achieve my goals without help.
"Wealthy people don't think about it, they do it."
Smart wealthy people think about it, and do it anyway!
Kurt Schweitzer
Urban Village ScootersPrivate Reply to Kurt Schweitzer |
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